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Post by patriotsnumero1fan on Oct 2, 2023 12:30:20 GMT -5
I haven’t heard much on JJ McCarthy.
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fessin
3rd String but playing on Special Teams
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Post by fessin on Oct 2, 2023 12:43:15 GMT -5
That upcoming draft will be easy for the Pats: trade the barn and get your (supposedly) franchise QB. Kind of like the Niners did for Lance?
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Post by seattlepat2016 on Oct 2, 2023 13:08:18 GMT -5
I haven’t heard much on JJ McCarthy. McCarthy has 83 of 105 pass attempts for a completion rate of 79%. It's a very good completion rate but his pass volume is low compared to the leaders. Williams: 105 of 141 pass attempts Penix: 133 of 178 Maye: 96 of 132 Daniels: 117 of 160 Nix: 131 of 163 Translation: McCarthy falls under the label of "Game Manager" -- i.e., not being asked to win the game with his arm; just manage the football and not make mistakes. NFL teams will be looking for QBs who can win the game with their arm AND not make mistakes doing that.
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Post by lowfbiq on Oct 2, 2023 13:08:46 GMT -5
Talked about as can't miss prospects
2021 T. Lawrence (no trade happened, player taken 1st) 2020 J. Burrow (maybe) (no trade happened, player taken 1st) 2012 A. Luck (no trade happened, player taken 1st) 2009 M. Stafford (maybe) (no trade happened, player taken 1st)
Not sure anyone is trading away a chance at anyone considered potentially generational
I'm going to say we could do a search through all the old draft threads and find how wrong all of us have been on various QB's from each draft class. It won't be easy.
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Post by patriotsnumero1fan on Oct 2, 2023 13:15:50 GMT -5
I haven’t heard much on JJ McCarthy. McCarthy has 83 of 105 pass attempts for a completion rate of 79%. It's a very good completion rate but his pass volume is low compared to the leaders. Williams: 105 of 141 pass attempts Penix: 133 of 178 Maye: 96 of 132 Daniels: 117 of 160 Nix: 131 of 163 Translation: McCarthy falls under the label of "Game Manager" -- i.e., not being asked to win the game with his arm; just manage the football and not make mistakes. NFL teams will be looking for QBs who can win the game with their arm AND not make mistakes doing that. I don’t think his arm is bad though. He has made some long throws. Interesting to see if his stock goes up during the combine.
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Post by patriotsnumero1fan on Oct 2, 2023 13:16:59 GMT -5
Talked about as can't miss prospects 2021 T. Lawrence (no trade happened, player taken 1st) 2020 J. Burrow (maybe) (no trade happened, player taken 1st) 2012 A. Luck (no trade happened, player taken 1st) 2009 M. Stafford (maybe) (no trade happened, player taken 1st) Not sure anyone is trading away a chance at anyone considered potentially generational I'm going to say we could do a search through all the old draft threads and find how wrong all of us have been on various QB's from each draft class. It won't be easy. There’s a kid playing at penn state who people say is considered generational. I think arch manning will be that as well.
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Post by seattlepat2016 on Oct 2, 2023 13:21:14 GMT -5
Talked about as can't miss prospects 2021 T. Lawrence (no trade happened, player taken 1st) 2020 J. Burrow (maybe) (no trade happened, player taken 1st) 2012 A. Luck (no trade happened, player taken 1st) 2009 M. Stafford (maybe) (no trade happened, player taken 1st) Not sure anyone is trading away a chance at anyone considered potentially generational I'm going to say we could do a search through all the old draft threads and find how wrong all of us have been on various QB's from each draft class. It won't be easy. I do not believe there is such a thing as a can't miss QB prospect. TB was a unicorn. Not gonna find another one of those. At least I do not view any of this year's QB prospects as generational... whatever that means. My preference for how they draft next year would be to build the lines on both sides of the trench. It's been a while since I have seen them dominate there. That is where I would want them to spend their first round pick. Be opportunistic in picking up a QB, but no earlier than their third pick (If they have 3 picks in the first 2 rds then they can pick a QB with their 2nd Rnd 2 pick). In the past I have been pretty rigid about the choice being someone who stays in the pocket. I am more open-minded now. I do not want another QB who is so dependent on having a clean pocket to be successful. That said, I still hate QBs who keep bails out of the pocket to try and get TDs or first downs with their legs when their first read is not there.
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Post by patriotsnumero1fan on Oct 2, 2023 13:26:09 GMT -5
That upcoming draft will be easy for the Pats: trade the barn and get your (supposedly) franchise QB. Kind of like the Niners did for Lance? Lance was a project yet the 49ers decided to go all in which was foolish.
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froglegs
3rd String but playing on Special Teams
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Post by froglegs on Oct 2, 2023 13:48:35 GMT -5
That upcoming draft will be easy for the Pats: trade the barn and get your (supposedly) franchise QB. down for that... as long as they can somehow find a OT and WR also They can use their cap for that purpose: pay (even overpay since you have a QB on his rookie deal) for top veterans.
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Post by fisher on Oct 2, 2023 13:49:19 GMT -5
Agree..Mac need a true backup Hope you enjoy the rest of this year because it’s the last time you’ll ever see macaroni going into the game as the starter If it’s meant to be, then let it happen… maybe we can trade for trey lance or fields …
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froglegs
3rd String but playing on Special Teams
Posts: 884
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Post by froglegs on Oct 2, 2023 13:55:26 GMT -5
That upcoming draft will be easy for the Pats: trade the barn and get your (supposedly) franchise QB. Kind of like the Niners did for Lance? Or kind of like the Chiefs did for Mahomes? At least the Niners tried and missed but they tried. Fortune favouring the bold, they found a QB in Mr. Irrelevant.
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Post by lowfbiq on Oct 2, 2023 15:30:53 GMT -5
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Post by squishthefish on Oct 2, 2023 15:49:53 GMT -5
That upcoming draft will be easy for the Pats: trade the barn and get your (supposedly) franchise QB. Kind of like the Niners did for Lance? Lance was raw, and had tools, but never played in a real pro offense and against any type of competition. That is the equivalent of drafting an 18 year old hs pitcher who played against kids in North Dakota with a 99 mph fb and rudimentary secondary pitches and control issues and hope he will become a #1 starter. It’s going to fail far more times than it will succeed. They swung for the fences and lost. Lucking into purdy saved their jobs.
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Post by squishthefish on Oct 2, 2023 15:58:15 GMT -5
Talked about as can't miss prospects 2021 T. Lawrence (no trade happened, player taken 1st) 2020 J. Burrow (maybe) (no trade happened, player taken 1st) 2012 A. Luck (no trade happened, player taken 1st) 2009 M. Stafford (maybe) (no trade happened, player taken 1st) Not sure anyone is trading away a chance at anyone considered potentially generational I'm going to say we could do a search through all the old draft threads and find how wrong all of us have been on various QB's from each draft class. It won't be easy. I wanted the pats to trade up for herbert the year he was drafted, I think maye should be their target this upcoming draft. www.profootballnetwork.com/drake-maye-draft-scouting-2024/For the pats, I hope next draft that maye comes to foxboro while it’s still April for the rest of the league!
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Post by johngrant on Oct 2, 2023 16:06:41 GMT -5
Talked about as can't miss prospects 2021 T. Lawrence (no trade happened, player taken 1st) 2020 J. Burrow (maybe) (no trade happened, player taken 1st) 2012 A. Luck (no trade happened, player taken 1st) 2009 M. Stafford (maybe) (no trade happened, player taken 1st) Not sure anyone is trading away a chance at anyone considered potentially generational I'm going to say we could do a search through all the old draft threads and find how wrong all of us have been on various QB's from each draft class. It won't be easy. I wanted the pats to trade up for herbert the year he was drafted, I think maye should be their target this upcoming draft. www.profootballnetwork.com/drake-maye-draft-scouting-2024/For the pats, I hope next draft that maye comes to foxboro while it’s still April for the rest of the league! Good scouting on Herbert. A lot of draftniks hated the Oregon offense and held it against Herbert. So many half field reads that looking from the outside they assumed the coaches had to keep it simple for him.
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Post by lowfbiq on Oct 2, 2023 16:15:02 GMT -5
Talked about as can't miss prospects 2021 T. Lawrence (no trade happened, player taken 1st) 2020 J. Burrow (maybe) (no trade happened, player taken 1st) 2012 A. Luck (no trade happened, player taken 1st) 2009 M. Stafford (maybe) (no trade happened, player taken 1st) Not sure anyone is trading away a chance at anyone considered potentially generational I'm going to say we could do a search through all the old draft threads and find how wrong all of us have been on various QB's from each draft class. It won't be easy. I wanted the pats to trade up for herbert the year he was drafted, I think maye should be their target this upcoming draft. www.profootballnetwork.com/drake-maye-draft-scouting-2024/For the pats, I hope next draft that maye comes to foxboro while it’s still April for the rest of the league! We are measuring success in SB wins correct? SB winsJones = 0 Herbert = 0 SB appearancesJones = 0 Herbert = 0 AFCCG appearancesJones = 0 Herbert = 0 Playoff recordJones = 0-1 Herbert = 0-1 Overall RecordJones = 17 - 18 Herbert = 27 - 26 EOS Strength of schedules faced (2021, 2022, 2023(so far))Jones = (12, 8, 6) Herbert = (17, 26, 7) [27th in 2020 when he went 6-9 as a rookie] This is not to say they are the same or even close, but I have not seen anything to suggest Herbert is "The guy" either, and that allegedly is what everyone says the Pats must have and must get.
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whiskeysour
On the Practice Squad
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Post by whiskeysour on Oct 2, 2023 16:31:45 GMT -5
I suspect this thread is going to get a lot of activity a lot earlier than most years.
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Post by squishthefish on Oct 2, 2023 16:34:18 GMT -5
I wanted the pats to trade up for herbert the year he was drafted, I think maye should be their target this upcoming draft. www.profootballnetwork.com/drake-maye-draft-scouting-2024/For the pats, I hope next draft that maye comes to foxboro while it’s still April for the rest of the league! We are measuring success in SB wins correct? SB winsJones = 0 Herbert = 0 SB appearancesJones = 0 Herbert = 0 AFCCG appearancesJones = 0 Herbert = 0 Playoff recordJones = 0-1 Herbert = 0-1 Overall RecordJones = 17 - 18 Herbert = 27 - 26 EOS Strength of schedules faced (2021, 2022, 2023(so far))Jones = (12, 8, 6) Herbert = (17, 26, 7) [27th in 2020 when he went 6-9 as a rookie] This is not to say they are the same or even close, but I have not seen anything to suggest Herbert is "The guy" either, and that allegedly is what everyone says the Pats must have and must get. It’s an apples to oranges comparison since we will never be able to see herbert play for the pats these past few years and Jones for the chargers these past few years. I do see a superior qb in herbert in every facet of his game and with a skillset mac will never have even if he reached his peak ceiling. If this was baseball and using a comparison, Rich Hill couldn’t become Randy Johnson even if he reached his peak. Hill could have solid outings, and some seasons when healthy, but he never could routinely put his team on his back and lead them to a win. He would need to be nearly perfect and even then his team would need the right offense and defense to have them win. Johnson could have games where the other team had no chance at all vs him. Herbert is Johnson, mac is hill.
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Post by lowfbiq on Oct 2, 2023 16:54:16 GMT -5
We are measuring success in SB wins correct? SB winsJones = 0 Herbert = 0 SB appearancesJones = 0 Herbert = 0 AFCCG appearancesJones = 0 Herbert = 0 Playoff recordJones = 0-1 Herbert = 0-1 Overall RecordJones = 17 - 18 Herbert = 27 - 26 EOS Strength of schedules faced (2021, 2022, 2023(so far))Jones = (12, 8, 6) Herbert = (17, 26, 7) [27th in 2020 when he went 6-9 as a rookie] This is not to say they are the same or even close, but I have not seen anything to suggest Herbert is "The guy" either, and that allegedly is what everyone says the Pats must have and must get. It’s an apples to oranges comparison since we will never be able to see herbert play for the pats these past few years and Jones for the chargers these past few years. I do see a superior qb in herbert in every facet of his game and with a skillset mac will never have even if he reached his peak ceiling. If this was baseball and using a comparison, Rich Hill couldn’t become Randy Johnson even if he reached his peak. Hill could have solid outings, and some seasons when healthy, but he never could routinely put his team on his back and lead them to a win. He would need to be nearly perfect and even then his team would need the right offense and defense to have them win. Johnson could have games where the other team had no chance at all vs him. Herbert is Johnson, mac is hill. Its all we got exactly because they don't play in each others teams, situations, and systems. Herbert has another chance this year to get his 1st playoff win. They are 2-2, lost to the Dolphins like the Pats and Mac, and beat the 1-3 Vikings and 1-3 Raiders starting their backup. Tools are just as irrelevant as allegedly being smart(jones) if you don't win at a very consistently level. Neither has done that yet. Longest win streaks:Jones = 7gms (2 years +) Herbert = 4gms (3 years +)
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Post by squishthefish on Oct 2, 2023 16:58:52 GMT -5
It’s an apples to oranges comparison since we will never be able to see herbert play for the pats these past few years and Jones for the chargers these past few years. I do see a superior qb in herbert in every facet of his game and with a skillset mac will never have even if he reached his peak ceiling. If this was baseball and using a comparison, Rich Hill couldn’t become Randy Johnson even if he reached his peak. Hill could have solid outings, and some seasons when healthy, but he never could routinely put his team on his back and lead them to a win. He would need to be nearly perfect and even then his team would need the right offense and defense to have them win. Johnson could have games where the other team had no chance at all vs him. Herbert is Johnson, mac is hill. Its all we got exactly because they don't play in each others teams, situations, and systems. Herbert has another chance this year to get his 1st playoff win. They are 2-2, lost to the Dolphins like the Pats and Mac, and beat the 1-3 Vikings and 1-3 Raiders starting their backup. Tools are just as irrelevant as allegedly being smart(jones) if you don't win at a very consistently level. Neither has done that yet. Longest win streaks:Jones = 7gms (2 years +) Herbert = 4gms (3 years +) If smart is all Jones has, I haven’t even seen that this year or last. If you were asked which qb you want to lead your team of the 2, which do you pick?
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Post by johngrant on Oct 2, 2023 17:10:37 GMT -5
Its all we got exactly because they don't play in each others teams, situations, and systems. Herbert has another chance this year to get his 1st playoff win. They are 2-2, lost to the Dolphins like the Pats and Mac, and beat the 1-3 Vikings and 1-3 Raiders starting their backup. Tools are just as irrelevant as allegedly being smart(jones) if you don't win at a very consistently level. Neither has done that yet. Longest win streaks:Jones = 7gms (2 years +) Herbert = 4gms (3 years +) If smart is all Jones has, I haven’t even seen that this year or last. If you were asked which qb you want to lead your team of the 2, which do you pick? To say Mac is a smart QB is a baseless accusation
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Post by lowfbiq on Oct 2, 2023 17:23:37 GMT -5
Its all we got exactly because they don't play in each others teams, situations, and systems. Herbert has another chance this year to get his 1st playoff win. They are 2-2, lost to the Dolphins like the Pats and Mac, and beat the 1-3 Vikings and 1-3 Raiders starting their backup. Tools are just as irrelevant as allegedly being smart(jones) if you don't win at a very consistently level. Neither has done that yet. Longest win streaks:Jones = 7gms (2 years +) Herbert = 4gms (3 years +) If smart is all Jones has, I haven’t even seen that this year or last. If you were asked which qb you want to lead your team of the 2, which do you pick? That is why I specifically said allegedly.
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Post by lowfbiq on Oct 2, 2023 17:39:54 GMT -5
What is going on with Drake Mayes team this season? 5 TDs and 4 INTs like Mac? He lose his top skill players last year to graduation? All of them off his guys hands? Long way to go and last year was very nice protecting the ball. Anyone got the context to this seasons start?
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Post by lowfbiq on Oct 2, 2023 17:42:18 GMT -5
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Post by squishthefish on Oct 2, 2023 18:32:03 GMT -5
What is going on with Drake Mayes team this season? 5 TDs and 4 INTs like Mac? He lose his top skill players last year to graduation? All of them off his guys hands? Long way to go and last year was very nice protecting the ball. Anyone got the context to this seasons start? They came from him being too aggressive vs sc and minnseota in games they won, not from awful throws that floated across the field for a pick 6 like a dandelion being blown on, or for a near end of game needed drive. It’s how you learn from those mistakes that shows your character. You don’t smile on a bench after you are benched for being awful and helped cause a blowout for your team, you go back out and try to win and don’t blame others for your mistakes. This may be a highlight reel video, but I see this kid making throws on the move that mac couldn’t do flat footed and stepping into his throw if he had a wind at his back blowing the ball forward. m.youtube.com/watch?v=E79mq3JHiW8&pp=ygUVZHJha2UgbWF5ZSBsb25nIHRocm93
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