danpat
3rd String but playing on Special Teams
Posts: 832
Likes: 283
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Post by danpat on Oct 23, 2017 4:44:58 GMT -5
I'm always nervous going into a game, but before this game I was terrified what Ryan and JJ could do to a secondary missing both Gilmore and Rowe. As it turned out there was no need for worries. In the most complete game the team has played all season, they dominated the Falcons in all phases of the game.
Brady was kept mostly clean and delivered a nice game, 21 of 29 for 249 yards with 2 TD's and no picks (though he was picked, it was called back due to a roughing the passer penalty). The running game was what stood out tonight, as the RB's combined for more than 160 yards, 0 TD's, zero fumbles. It was evident that the team used a committee-approach, but as the game went along, Lewis turned out to be the RB that got the most carries. The dominance in the running game played a large part in the team also holding a huge edge in TOP.
On defense it was a surprise to see the Falcons struggle as much as they did. After succesfully converting early on a 4th & 6 (or 7?), they stalled and things went downhill from there. Ryans total sounds okay, 23 of 33 for 233 and a TD, but part of it came in the last 20 seconds of the 2nd quarter, where the Patriots D played to prevent a big play, and part of it came in garbage time on the Falcons last drive of the game, where BB and Matt Patricia traded time for points. Ryan found Julio Jones for a TD, but the drive consumed more than 5 minutes, and with the failed onside-kick Atlanta never held the football again. All in all, the difference was on 3rd down, where Atlanta was 2 of 9 (and 1 of 3 on 4th).
BB needs to find a way to keep Malcolm Butler. Bademosi looks like he can play. Harris has value against the run. Hightower was hurt again. The D looked faster and less confused than in previous games. Pressure is still an issue, as they managed to sack Ryan only once.
All in all, it seems like they are finding their form. This is not going to be a dominant D, and not as good as we had hoped before the season started. But maybe they aren't going to be the liability they were in weeks 1-4.
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Post by ATJ on Oct 23, 2017 5:47:32 GMT -5
Agree that this was a complete game win for the Pats. The Pats D showed up from the outset and played their best game of the year. Also agree there is a great deal of work to do on D but I find it interesting that of the 7 games the Pats have played they've held the opponent to 20 points or fewer 4 times.
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Post by Shelly on Oct 23, 2017 6:02:23 GMT -5
One other good thing coming out of these last two games without Gilmore and Rowe. We are building our depth at cornerback by Bademosi and Jones getting valuable playing time.
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Post by croc on Oct 23, 2017 6:02:55 GMT -5
Incredibly some nitwits are blaming the Pats for creating fog.
Just being in position, not getting stupid penalties and tackling makes the D look decent
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Post by nflpatsfan on Oct 23, 2017 6:43:13 GMT -5
Incredibly some nitwits are blaming the Pats for creating fog. Yikes, Foggate next?
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Post by agcsbill on Oct 23, 2017 6:46:05 GMT -5
I'm always nervous going into a game, but before this game I was terrified what Ryan and JJ could do to a secondary missing both Gilmore and Rowe. As it turned out there was no need for worries. In the most complete game the team has played all season, they dominated the Falcons in all phases of the game.
Brady was kept mostly clean and delivered a nice game, 21 of 29 for 249 yards with 2 TD's and no picks (though he was picked, it was called back due to a roughing the passer penalty). The running game was what stood out tonight, as the RB's combined for more than 160 yards, 0 TD's, zero fumbles. It was evident that the team used a committee-approach, but as the game went along, Lewis turned out to be the RB that got the most carries. The dominance in the running game played a large part in the team also holding a huge edge in TOP.
On defense it was a surprise to see the Falcons struggle as much as they did. After succesfully converting early on a 4th & 6 (or 7?), they stalled and things went downhill from there. Ryans total sounds okay, 23 of 33 for 233 and a TD, but part of it came in the last 20 seconds of the 2nd quarter, where the Patriots D played to prevent a big play, and part of it came in garbage time on the Falcons last drive of the game, where BB and Matt Patricia traded time for points. Ryan found Julio Jones for a TD, but the drive consumed more than 5 minutes, and with the failed onside-kick Atlanta never held the football again. All in all, the difference was on 3rd down, where Atlanta was 2 of 9 (and 1 of 3 on 4th).
BB needs to find a way to keep Malcolm Butler. Bademosi looks like he can play. Harris has value against the run. Hightower was hurt again. The D looked faster and less confused than in previous games. Pressure is still an issue, as they managed to sack Ryan only once.
All in all, it seems like they are finding their form. This is not going to be a dominant D, and not as good as we had hoped before the season started. But maybe they aren't going to be the liability they were in weeks 1-4.
This game may have been the coming out party for what could be a dominating D. Was there a better offense to showcase a dominating performance than against the Falcons? True, this is only one game, but, this is the third game in a row in which we saw improved defensive performance.
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Post by patslifer on Oct 23, 2017 7:03:50 GMT -5
This game may have been the coming out party for what could be a dominating D. Was there a better offense to showcase a dominating performance than against the Falcons? True, this is only one game, but, this is the third game in a row in which we saw improved defensive performance. I get what you are saying, but I would have rather had that stout defensive performance against an AFC team, preferably KC or Pittsburgh. It was a great defensive performance, and I have lots of questions around why now. Why with a depleted secondary? Why is Butler playing better now, over the past 2 games than with GIlmore/Rowe in the lineup? Why haven't we seen Harris before now? Harris looked pretty darn good last night. Not to take anything away from the Pats D...I hope this trend continues. But the Atlanta we saw last night was not the same dominant, high scoring offense of last year. Yes, they have the same personnel, but their OC has really changed the way that team plays. Would anyone guess that the Falcons offense would be scoreless for over 90 minutes of game time? No way.
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Post by patseng on Oct 23, 2017 7:57:43 GMT -5
This was easily the best game the D has played all year. For the first time this year it felt like the Pats D was dictating the game and not the other way around. People can say that the D has been building up to this but this year the D has yet to really dictate what the other O did and no game up to know showed a hint of this. This game was like a light switch flip in how the D performed and it's not even close, part of that might be game planning. They played a completely different game than even last week. The first 6 weeks you could see signs of carrying game plans from one to the other but this one they felt aggressive, they played a lot of man early, and they weren't playing soft at the line. It almost felt like a completely different D and except in the end (with the 2 S deep coverage) it felt like they scrapped basically everything in the first 6 weeks and started from step one
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Post by rkarp on Oct 23, 2017 8:06:52 GMT -5
This was easily the best game the D has played all year. For the first time this year it felt like the Pats D was dictating the game and not the other way around. People can say that the D has been building up to this but this year the D has yet to really dictate what the other O did and no game up to know showed a hint of this. This game was like a light switch flip in how the D performed and it's not even close, part of that might be game planning. They played a completely different game than even last week. The first 6 weeks you could see signs of carrying game plans from one to the other but this one they felt aggressive, they played a lot of man early, and they weren't playing soft at the line. It almost felt like a completely different D and except in the end (with the 2 S deep coverage) it felt like they scrapped basically everything in the first 6 weeks and started from step one wow, have we been watching different games.
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Post by wazzu on Oct 23, 2017 8:20:53 GMT -5
This was easily the best game the D has played all year. For the first time this year it felt like the Pats D was dictating the game and not the other way around. People can say that the D has been building up to this but this year the D has yet to really dictate what the other O did and no game up to know showed a hint of this. This game was like a light switch flip in how the D performed and it's not even close, part of that might be game planning. They played a completely different game than even last week. The first 6 weeks you could see signs of carrying game plans from one to the other but this one they felt aggressive, they played a lot of man early, and they weren't playing soft at the line. It almost felt like a completely different D and except in the end (with the 2 S deep coverage) it felt like they scrapped basically everything in the first 6 weeks and started from step one Disagree. The problems early were communication breakdowns. Those are getting ironed out as the players are getting more comfortable. They haven’t scrapped anything. That’s a cop-out from people who ripped the D earlier this year and said we didn’t have enough talent.
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Post by fletcherbrook on Oct 23, 2017 8:27:34 GMT -5
are we forgetting the missed plays that were really not due to anything the pats did? Yes the defense was outstanding in context. THy looked much faster and more organized. I suggest you read bill barnwells piece today to put the pats last 3 or 4 defensive games in perspective. that being said I'm not sure it matters a whole hell of a lot because even if they aren't as good as they looked yesterday ive been saying all along...even a functional, solid defense and this team is a contender.
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danpat
3rd String but playing on Special Teams
Posts: 832
Likes: 283
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Post by danpat on Oct 23, 2017 8:29:41 GMT -5
I'm always nervous going into a game, but before this game I was terrified what Ryan and JJ could do to a secondary missing both Gilmore and Rowe. As it turned out there was no need for worries. In the most complete game the team has played all season, they dominated the Falcons in all phases of the game.
Brady was kept mostly clean and delivered a nice game, 21 of 29 for 249 yards with 2 TD's and no picks (though he was picked, it was called back due to a roughing the passer penalty). The running game was what stood out tonight, as the RB's combined for more than 160 yards, 0 TD's, zero fumbles. It was evident that the team used a committee-approach, but as the game went along, Lewis turned out to be the RB that got the most carries. The dominance in the running game played a large part in the team also holding a huge edge in TOP.
On defense it was a surprise to see the Falcons struggle as much as they did. After succesfully converting early on a 4th & 6 (or 7?), they stalled and things went downhill from there. Ryans total sounds okay, 23 of 33 for 233 and a TD, but part of it came in the last 20 seconds of the 2nd quarter, where the Patriots D played to prevent a big play, and part of it came in garbage time on the Falcons last drive of the game, where BB and Matt Patricia traded time for points. Ryan found Julio Jones for a TD, but the drive consumed more than 5 minutes, and with the failed onside-kick Atlanta never held the football again. All in all, the difference was on 3rd down, where Atlanta was 2 of 9 (and 1 of 3 on 4th).
BB needs to find a way to keep Malcolm Butler. Bademosi looks like he can play. Harris has value against the run. Hightower was hurt again. The D looked faster and less confused than in previous games. Pressure is still an issue, as they managed to sack Ryan only once.
All in all, it seems like they are finding their form. This is not going to be a dominant D, and not as good as we had hoped before the season started. But maybe they aren't going to be the liability they were in weeks 1-4.
This game may have been the coming out party for what could be a dominating D. Was there a better offense to showcase a dominating performance than against the Falcons? True, this is only one game, but, this is the third game in a row in which we saw improved defensive performance. I think it was a coming out party for a D that can be good. I'll need to see it for a few more games before I'll go further than that. I'm usually concerned with the one metric that matters, points, and last night was very good on that front, as was the last few games.
But when I think of really dominant defensive efforts, I'm thinking multiple turnovers, lots of pressure, stopping the run - on top of few points allowed. For now I'll settle for a clean game, no confussion, no blown coverages, playing with intensity and speed. That's what we got, and if they can sustain it, it could be good enough.
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Post by patseng on Oct 23, 2017 8:45:58 GMT -5
This was easily the best game the D has played all year. For the first time this year it felt like the Pats D was dictating the game and not the other way around. People can say that the D has been building up to this but this year the D has yet to really dictate what the other O did and no game up to know showed a hint of this. This game was like a light switch flip in how the D performed and it's not even close, part of that might be game planning. They played a completely different game than even last week. The first 6 weeks you could see signs of carrying game plans from one to the other but this one they felt aggressive, they played a lot of man early, and they weren't playing soft at the line. It almost felt like a completely different D and except in the end (with the 2 S deep coverage) it felt like they scrapped basically everything in the first 6 weeks and started from step one wow, have we been watching different games. Clearly we have we you make comments after the 2nd game that the OL played well and giving up 300+yrds to QBs 6 games in a row for the first time in BBs career was working as intended. Clearly this game was completely different from every other game and Zo even acknowledged that
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Post by patseng on Oct 23, 2017 8:49:26 GMT -5
This was easily the best game the D has played all year. For the first time this year it felt like the Pats D was dictating the game and not the other way around. People can say that the D has been building up to this but this year the D has yet to really dictate what the other O did and no game up to know showed a hint of this. This game was like a light switch flip in how the D performed and it's not even close, part of that might be game planning. They played a completely different game than even last week. The first 6 weeks you could see signs of carrying game plans from one to the other but this one they felt aggressive, they played a lot of man early, and they weren't playing soft at the line. It almost felt like a completely different D and except in the end (with the 2 S deep coverage) it felt like they scrapped basically everything in the first 6 weeks and started from step one Disagree. The problems early were communication breakdowns. Those are getting ironed out as the players are getting more comfortable. They haven’t scrapped anything. That’s a cop-out from people who ripped the D earlier this year and said we didn’t have enough talent. The first 4 games they played almost all zone, the last 2 they played mostly man. They rushed on average 3-4 the first 6 weeks, this weeks they averaged 5 rush (before the 4th and they went into shell). They blitzed more than any other game. The game plan last night was drastically different than the previous 6 games, yes communication was an issue and it is being ironed out but they have switched gears on D scheme and last night they were much more aggressive and played more man up coverage than the 6 weeks previously. Call it a cop out I call it knowing the game
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fessin
3rd String but playing on Special Teams
Posts: 715
Likes: 671
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Post by fessin on Oct 23, 2017 8:55:09 GMT -5
Incredibly some nitwits are blaming the Pats for creating fog. Yikes, Foggate next? I predicted this on the game thread.
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Post by muzwell on Oct 23, 2017 9:05:25 GMT -5
Incredibly some nitwits are blaming the Pats for creating fog. You're saying they didn't? So, was this like Cincy in '14 or Indy in years past where the running game was featured only to be shelved again the next week? Because that's what carried them yesterday. I fail to see why they can't do that every week. Yeah, yeah I get the game planning stuff. Week to week based on the opponent and all that. But, it sure makes life easier when you can run it. Which I'm 100% convinced they can, against anyone if they decide to.
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Post by jri37 on Oct 23, 2017 9:07:00 GMT -5
Incredibly some nitwits are blaming the Pats for creating fog. You're saying they didn't?So, was this like Cincy in '14 or Indy in years past where the running game was featured only to be shelved again the next week? Because that's what carried them yesterday. I fail to see why they can't do that every week. Yeah, yeah I get the game planning stuff. Week to week based on the opponent and all that. But, it sure makes life easier when you can run it. Which I'm 100% convinced they can, against anyone if they decide to. He most certainly did...
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Post by patseng on Oct 23, 2017 9:11:06 GMT -5
Incredibly some nitwits are blaming the Pats for creating fog. You're saying they didn't? So, was this like Cincy in '14 or Indy in years past where the running game was featured only to be shelved again the next week? Because that's what carried them yesterday. I fail to see why they can't do that every week. Yeah, yeah I get the game planning stuff. Week to week based on the opponent and all that. But, it sure makes life easier when you can run it. Which I'm 100% convinced they can, against anyone if they decide to. Once Burkhead gets more legs underneath him it will go a long way. I noticed when it was primarily White and Gills it was too easy to game plane. With Lewis it adds a wrinkle other teams need to respect and now with Burkhead it only heightens that wrinkle. I think it was very telling they used Burkhead and Lewis early to establish the run which later paid off. Having two guys with some flexibility imo helped pave the way for guys that traditionally have been used 1 dimensionally
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Post by portfolio1 on Oct 23, 2017 9:21:02 GMT -5
For this D to click it NEEDS those BIG men at DT. Brown and Branch healthy at minimum. Valentine was important in keeping those two fresh and healthy and giving us solid playing depth. The three together are a big deal (no pun intended). If we find ourselves down to one big man the D will suffer in significant ways. Some will not recognize the root of it but the D starts in the middle with those big men. They are the foundation. The rock on which BB builds his defensive church. Like it or not.
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Post by jri37 on Oct 23, 2017 9:24:34 GMT -5
For this D to click it NEEDS those BIG men at DT. Brown and Branch healthy at minimum. Valentine was important in keeping those two fresh and healthy and giving us solid playing depth. The three together are a big deal (no pun intended). If we find ourselves down to one big man the D will suffer in significant ways. Some will not recognize the root of it but the D starts in the middle with those big men. They are the foundation. The rock on which BB builds his defensive church. Like it or not. I thought the effort of all those guys on the Dline was outstanding. Marsh, Wise, Butler, Guy, Flowers, Branch and Brown all played hard and with urgency.
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Deleted
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Post by Deleted on Oct 23, 2017 9:46:51 GMT -5
This game reminded me of the Denver game last year. It looked boring, but we dominated. Ran a lot in that game, waited for Opponent to make mistakes, and took advantage of them. (4th down, in that game big INT) I get it like to see the passing, but when this team plays boring football, we play some of our best games.
Get the lead, No Turnovers, and use the Play-Action, to slow down the Pass Rush. Then change your Offense, after Defense made adjustments, knowing you will use the run game, as part of your Offense.
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Post by philskiw on Oct 23, 2017 10:02:46 GMT -5
My binky Burkhead played well. Guy I haven’t seen a lot from and my other binky valentine I don’t think returns.
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Post by portfolio1 on Oct 23, 2017 10:09:57 GMT -5
For this D to click it NEEDS those BIG men at DT. Brown and Branch healthy at minimum. Valentine was important in keeping those two fresh and healthy and giving us solid playing depth. The three together are a big deal (no pun intended). If we find ourselves down to one big man the D will suffer in significant ways. Some will not recognize the root of it but the D starts in the middle with those big men. They are the foundation. The rock on which BB builds his defensive church. Like it or not. I thought the effort of all those guys on the Dline was outstanding. Marsh, Wise, Butler, Guy, Flowers, Branch and Brown all played hard and with urgency. I agree. But there was one play where we saw the danger of having a problem inside. It was a run and Brown was out. Branch needed to make the play - at least to force the runner elsewhere. What happened was that he had to stretch to try to make the play and failed at an arm tackle. That was an inside run. If the DTs are breaking down inside they are likely not giving enough support as play moves outside and so weak inside support for the edge players. This puts the edge players more on an island and there the next set of problems start.... Its a little like having a problem with your foot and so you start to favor the other foot or try to otherwise compensate. Try running a race, sprint or distance... and you develop other problems stemming form the original. My point is not to lessen the import of other positions but only to shed some light on the criticality of the play of the DTs on the performance of the rest of the D. And on this team one lone big man will not cut it over the stretch of a season or a big game.
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Post by jri37 on Oct 23, 2017 10:16:35 GMT -5
I thought the effort of all those guys on the Dline was outstanding. Marsh, Wise, Butler, Guy, Flowers, Branch and Brown all played hard and with urgency. I agree. But there was one play where we saw the danger of having a problem inside. It was a run and Brown was out. Branch needed to make the play - at least to force the runner elsewhere. What happened was that he had to stretch to try to make the play and failed at an arm tackle. That was an inside run. If the DTs are breaking down inside they are likely not giving enough support as play moves outside and so weak inside support for the edge players. This puts the edge players more on an island and there the next set of problems start.... Its a little like having a problem with your foot and so you start to favor the other foot or try to otherwise compensate. Try running a race, sprint or distance... and you develop other problems stemming form the original. My point is not to lessen the import of other positions but only to shed some light on the criticality of the play of the DTs on the performance of the rest of the D. And on this team one lone big man will not cut it over the stretch of a season or a big game. I remeber the play. Branch tried to shed his block and seemed to attempt the tackle up a little to high, was a little late and couldn't wrap. Tough play but could have been made but I'll say this at least the effort was there.
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Post by kjfitone on Oct 23, 2017 10:17:33 GMT -5
I'm always nervous going into a game, but before this game I was terrified what Ryan and JJ could do to a secondary missing both Gilmore and Rowe. As it turned out there was no need for worries. In the most complete game the team has played all season, they dominated the Falcons in all phases of the game.
Brady was kept mostly clean and delivered a nice game, 21 of 29 for 249 yards with 2 TD's and no picks (though he was picked, it was called back due to a roughing the passer penalty). The running game was what stood out tonight, as the RB's combined for more than 160 yards, 0 TD's, zero fumbles. It was evident that the team used a committee-approach, but as the game went along, Lewis turned out to be the RB that got the most carries. The dominance in the running game played a large part in the team also holding a huge edge in TOP.
On defense it was a surprise to see the Falcons struggle as much as they did. After succesfully converting early on a 4th & 6 (or 7?), they stalled and things went downhill from there. Ryans total sounds okay, 23 of 33 for 233 and a TD, but part of it came in the last 20 seconds of the 2nd quarter, where the Patriots D played to prevent a big play, and part of it came in garbage time on the Falcons last drive of the game, where BB and Matt Patricia traded time for points. Ryan found Julio Jones for a TD, but the drive consumed more than 5 minutes, and with the failed onside-kick Atlanta never held the football again. All in all, the difference was on 3rd down, where Atlanta was 2 of 9 (and 1 of 3 on 4th).
BB needs to find a way to keep Malcolm Butler. Bademosi looks like he can play. Harris has value against the run. Hightower was hurt again. The D looked faster and less confused than in previous games. Pressure is still an issue, as they managed to sack Ryan only once.
All in all, it seems like they are finding their form. This is not going to be a dominant D, and not as good as we had hoped before the season started. But maybe they aren't going to be the liability they were in weeks 1-4.
This game may have been the coming out party for what could be a dominating D. Was there a better offense to showcase a dominating performance than against the Falcons? True, this is only one game, but, this is the third game in a row in which we saw improved defensive performance. Yup, they've been improving starting with the Tampa game and took a big step forward last night. Since BB has been coach the d has gradually improved throughout each season. Every season there are new players and it takes some time for them to learn the scheme and gel with the other players but eventually they do. They play very well as a unit and tough in the red zone. Barring too many injuries I'd expect the d to continue it's improvement. The defense will be fine imo.
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